Translation of Trac to German/Deutsch [de_DE]

[asmodai@…]

This ticket should be used to coordinate the translation to German.

[asmodai@…]

See also TracTermsDe.

[jruigrok]

There's preliminary work done in source:sandbox/i18n/trac/locale/de_DE/LC_MESSAGES/messages.po

[Axel Gembe]

German localization update

[Axel Gembe]

This is an updated localization file against the latest version from sandbox.

[cboos]

Please follow trunk now that the branch has been merged. Asmodai, you should perhaps remove source:sandbox/i18n, in order to reduce the possible confusion.

[jruigrok]

It's removed now, still a bit behind on everything. Thanks for the heads up. Let me integrate Axel's stuff now.

[anonymous]

Ooops, didn't know it was merged already. Someone should also edit TracDev/SandBox and put it under completed branches.

[jruigrok]

Committed in r7005.

TracDev/SandBox has been adjusted.

[jruigrok]

By the way Axel, yes, your comments in some places in the file are correct. It's still something we are working on for fixing. See for more background  #G129.

[Axel Gembe]

Some more german translations

[Axel Gembe]

I've added another patch with more translations and a few that were left out of the previous commit (intentional?) About the comments, I've just added them to know where changes to the source code are needed. There is one really bad hack in those translations I posted.

[Axel Gembe]

Hmm, I just tried trunk with the translations, and I seem to get this:

Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/Trac-0.12dev-py2.5.egg/trac/web/api.py", line 346, in send_error
    translation.deactivate()
  File "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/Trac-0.12dev-py2.5.egg/trac/util/translation.py", line 79, in deactivate
    del _current.translations
AttributeError: translations

Is this a known problem ?

[Axel Gembe]

Fix a typo in the last patch

[Axel Gembe]

Fix another typo in the last patch

[Axel Gembe]

Fix some typos in the last patch

[cboos]

Replying to Axel Gembe:

... del _current.translations ... AttributeError: translations }}}

Is this a known problem ?

More or less: I saw it and tried to trigger it, but when failing to do so, I wrongly concluded this couldn't happen ;-) Could you look up the original error in your Trac log? (what you pasted above was a secondary error which happened after rendering of the original error)

[Axel Gembe]

Sure, I just have to figure out trac logging. Expect a log in a few minutes.

[Axel Gembe]

Sorry, I don't know why, but its working again now. I've replaced the default config with one that does logging and reset the permissions on the trac folder, now it works.

[cboos]

Replying to cboos:

Replying to Axel Gembe:

... del _current.translations ... AttributeError: translations }}}

Is this a known problem ?

More or less: I saw it and tried to trigger it, but when failing to do so, I wrongly concluded this couldn't happen ;-)

Fixed in r7051.

[benjamin-ruehl@…]

Hello,

nice work. Is ist possible to include/install this languagepackage in trac 0.9 und how can i do this?

Thanks.

[jruigrok]

No, trunk only.

[jruigrok]

Applied in r7139. Vielen Dank.

[Axel Gembe]

Fix 3 mistranslated strings

[Axel Gembe]

I've added another patch which fixes some errors I made while translating.

[Axel Gembe]

Update translation again (delete last one plz)

[jruigrok]

Hi Axel,

committed in r7282.

I left suchen with a small letter since it is still a verb, right? So no need to make it Suchen for all I know and could verify with other native German speakers.

Vielen Dank.

[anonymous]

Ein paar andere Vorschläge:

• Timeline (Zeitleiste) -> Zeitachse
• Roadmap (Fahrplan) -> Projektplan
• enhancement (Verbesserungsvorschlag) -> Verbesserung // Ist doch sonst zu lange. Aber scheint sowieso nicht zu gehen.

[Simon <saimen54@…>]

Replying to anonymous:

Ein paar andere Vorschläge:

Timeline (Zeitleiste) -> Zeitachse

Roadmap (Fahrplan) -> Projektplan

enhancement (Verbesserungsvorschlag) -> Verbesserung // Ist doch sonst zu lange.

I agree. IMO "Fahrplan" is not really the correct term for this context.

Some different suggestions:

• wontfix (abgelehnt) -> keineLösung // The current proposal has a completely different meaning. At least I don't use "wontfix" for this meaning.
• reopened (wiedereröffnet) -> wiedergeöffnet // The current proposal applies more e.g. to a shop reopening for me, but that might be a dialect issue :)
• attached to ... by ... (angehangen an ... von ...) -> angehängt an ... von ...
• reopened by ... (wiedereröffnet von ...) -> wieder geöffnet von ... // see above
• milestone completed (Meilenstein erreicht) -> Meilenstein vollständig or Meilenstein abgeschlossen

[kontakt at meitzner dot net]

• Roadmap -> I'd favour "Projektplan" in most cases
  • Timeline -> What about "Verlauf" here?
  • enhancement -> It's long, but I've come to actually use "Verbesserungsvorschlag" in the end, since it fits best semantically. "Erweiterung" should be a candidate, too.
  • wontfix -> "bleibtso" ;-)
  • milestone completed -> "Meilenstein abgeschlossen" fits best I'd say.

[Simon <saimen54@…>]

Replying to kontakt at meitzner dot net:

Timeline -> What about "Verlauf" here?

That's a good idea

enhancement -> It's long, but I've come to actually use "Verbesserungsvorschlag" in the end, since it fits best semantically. "Erweiterung" should be a candidate, too.

From my point of view "Verbesserung" or "Erweiterung" would be okay. Following your argument on "Verbesserungsvorschlag" then it should be called "Erweiterungsvorschlag", too ;)

wontfix -> "bleibtso" ;-)

Colloquial, but closest translation to wontfix :)

milestone completed -> "Meilenstein abgeschlossen" fits best I'd say.

yep

[jruigrok]

I'll gladly apply any patches once you reach sort of a consensus. :)

[Simon <saimen54@…>]

Personally I agree on these proposals. Any other comments?

[Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>]

Yes! I've got something. Please stand by.

[Simon <saimen54@…>]

Replying to Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>:

Yes! I've got something. Please stand by.

Standing by... :)

[Simon <saimen54@…>]

Should the changes proposed in comment:26, comment:27, comment:28 and comment:29 be applied as no further remarks have been made here for quite some time?

[cboos]

Well, those suggestions were only discussed, no actual patch was proposed so there's nothing to apply...

[Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>]

The German Trac Dictionary was very outdated and incomplete. I have overworked and amended it a lot based on the current messages.po and on the prudent choice of terms in the English Trac version.

So now we have a unified common set of German terms again which can be consistently used throughout the web pages and messages of Trac.

[Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>]

loc-de_DE-trunk-r7492-1.patch

[Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>]

And here is a new German translation based on the current dictionary. It's a patch for the latest trunk version r7492 of messages.po.

Besides turning to account the dictionary terms in a consistent manner I have fixed a lot of errors in respect to Syntax and Semantics.

There had also been a multitude of non-trivial inconsistencies pertaining to clause position and other grammatical differences between English and German. The way Trac messages and texts are arranged and divided into pieces does not yet take into account the structure of languages different from English.

[Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>]

Germanized Trac logo as PNG.

[Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>]

Germanized Trac banner (About dialog) as PNG.

[Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>]

Aren't the Germans well-known for doing things thoroughly? So I think we have to comply to that. Yes we can! (Ja, wir Büchse!) ;-)

For that reason I also germanized the Trac logo. Doesn't it look handsome?

[Simon <saimen54@…>]

I've reviewed TracTermsDe and I have some remarks:

• wontfix / abgelehnt -> As pointed out in 27 I don't use "wontfix" for rejecting tickets/issues only. I use wontfix in a more general way, e.g. also if the problem depends on a external lib and a change of the lib to fix that issue cannot be done. So for me the translations "bleibt so" or "keine Lösung" would be better. Any other opinions how wontfix is used?
• worksforme / ohne Beanstandung -> Maybe "nicht reproduzierbar"?
• Resolution / Bearbeitungszustand -> For me resolution should be translated with "Lösung". The current term "Bearbeitungszustand" is more like "Status of progress". N.B. where is the term "Resolution" used in the ticket system anyway?
• Milestone completed / Meilenstein erreicht -> "Meilenstein abgeschlossen"?

[Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>]

Replying to Simon <saimen54@…>:

Simon, thank you for your review comments.

• wontfix / abgelehnt -> As pointed out in 27 I don't use "wontfix" for rejecting tickets/issues only. I use wontfix in a more general way, e.g. also if the problem depends on a external lib and a change of the lib to fix that issue cannot be done. So for me the translations "bleibt so" or "keine Lösung" would be better. Any other opinions how wontfix is used?

You've made clear that wontfix is just a matter of doing or not doing the fix - in contrast to the worksforme resolution even without any judgement about whether the software works. So we should choose a clear-cut and value-neutral wording for the rejection of the fix.

• worksforme / ohne Beanstandung -> Maybe "nicht reproduzierbar"?

Normally you do the setup, test it, and say: "for me it works". Then you have reproduced it, but you have judged that you don't object to it. So how do we call that then in German? - "getestet und für gut befunden" - "in Ordnung" - "funktioniert" - ... But in any case you have to make clear whether the implied judgement is about the software or about the ticket.

• Resolution / Bearbeitungszustand -> For me resolution should be translated with "Lösung". The current term "Bearbeitungszustand" is more like "Status of progress".

Would you want the system to tell you "Die Lösung ist Duplikat" or "Die Lösung ist ungültig"? It is true that we are not talking about the status of progress (workflow). What do you think about "Status der Lösung" or "Lösungszustand"?

N.B. where is the term "Resolution" used in the ticket system anyway?

It occurs as a shadowy existence in a currently hidden admin panel, in the custom ticket query and in some hint messages. So we are not duty bound to keep the wording short.

• Milestone completed / Meilenstein erreicht -> "Meilenstein abgeschlossen"?

From the sense of words it is better, and I have considered this, too. I chose "erreicht" because it better matches the idea of a mile-stone along a road-map.

[Simon <saimen54@…>]

Replying to Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>:

You've made clear that wontfix is just a matter of doing or not doing the fix - in contrast to the worksforme resolution even without any judgement about whether the software works. So we should choose a clear-cut and value-neutral wording for the rejection of the fix.

Normally you do the setup, test it, and say: "for me it works". Then you have reproduced it, but you have judged that you don't object to it. So how do we call that then in German? - "getestet und für gut befunden" - "in Ordnung" - "funktioniert" - ... But in any case you have to make clear whether the implied judgement is about the software or about the ticket.

OK, agreed. I've re-thought my own workflows for the use of wontfix and worksforme as well :)

Would you want the system to tell you "Die Lösung ist Duplikat" or "Die Lösung ist ungültig"? It is true that we are not talking about the status of progress (workflow). What do you think about "Status der Lösung" or "Lösungszustand"?

I would agree with "Status der Lösung"

N.B. where is the term "Resolution" used in the ticket system anyway?

It occurs as a shadowy existence in a currently hidden admin panel, in the custom ticket query and in some hint messages. So we are not duty bound to keep the wording short.

Ah, okay

From the sense of words it is better, and I have considered this, too. I chose "erreicht" because it better matches the idea of a mile-stone along a road-map.

OK, would be fine for me, too.

[Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>]

I have added a Wiki page  TracGermanTranslation on Trac Hacks as a cross-reference to our work.

[jruigrok]

So is there a patch that I can apply right now or does it need revising because of the terms you have been discussing above?

[Simon <saimen54@…>]

Heiko, if you agree on "Status der Lösung", you could add this to the patch. The other discussed items are okay for me.

[Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>]

Patch of German PO Catalog file ready for milestone:0.12 .

[Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>]

Replying to jruigrok:

So is there a patch that I can apply right now or does it need revising because of the terms you have been discussing above?

The patch is ready for integration.

Simon, it also includes the "Status der Lösung" wording. Furthermore I have updated and reworked the catalog with the latest set of messages (more than 80 new ones).

[jruigrok]

Committed in r7746. Vielen Dank.

Simon, what's your last name (so I can properly add you to THANKS).

[Simon <saimen54@…>]

Martin is my last name :)

[anonymous]

Hi!

Just one comment on "Status der Lösung": this might make sense to someone who knows the original English term, but by itself, it is pretty incomprehensible. I mean, what the hell is "status of solution" supposed to mean?

I don't really have a better translation at hand, but maybe it should be something along the lines of "Prüfungsergebnis". Or, from the point of view of the reporter, you could also use something like "Bescheid", although that sounds a bit too much like it came from the Bundesagentur für Arbeit :-)

[Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>]

Replying to anonymous:

Yes, I get your point. As you may have noticed it is not easy to find appropriate terms for everything. The "Status der Lösung" is already the product of some discussion and agreement. But you really have given a better idea for the sense of this resolution. Coming from there - how does "Bearbeitungsergebnis" or "Beurteilung" sound to you?

By the way this term occurs in very few places in Trac.

[anonymous]

Why not simply keep the term "Status" or "Aktueller Status"? The other terms sound pretty over-engineered to me...

[Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>]

Replying to anonymous:

Why not simply keep the term "Status" or "Aktueller Status"? The other terms sound pretty over-engineered to me...

There are two different attributes of a ticket:

• the status which can be new, assigned, reopened, or closed
• the resolution which can be fixed, invalid, wontfix, duplicate, or worksforme

The current joint effort is towards finding a suitable German word for the resolution.

So when you set the status of a ticket to closed ("dessen Bearbeitung abschließen") by for example resolving it as duplicate ("es als Duplikat beurteilen"), the question is then if you would say in German that "die Beurteilung ist: Duplikat".

By the way, what's your name or pseudonym?

[Gregor Wegberg <gregor@…>]

two changes: "up/down" => "hoch/runter", "Verantwortlichkeit" => "Verantwortung"

[Gregor Wegberg <gregor@…>]

I just added a small change (trac_locale_de-DE_LC-MESSAGES_r7934.patch). "up/down" changed to "hoch/runter" (now it's really German) and changed "Verantwortlichkeit" to "Verantwortung" (from my point of view this seems to sound better).

I hope this is useful. If not - no problem - just try to give something back. Else I think the translation is great, thank you!

[Gregor Wegberg <gregor@…>]

Replying to Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…> and to Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>:

I would use for "resolution" "Lösung" so: "Die Lösung ist: Duplikat". Sounds fine for me or do I miss the point (I'm referring to the translation of " msgid "The resolution will be set" ")

cheers, gregor

[sonicpictures]

Replying to Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>:

Replying to anonymous:

Yes, I get your point. As you may have noticed it is not easy to find appropriate terms for everything. The "Status der Lösung" is already the product of some discussion and agreement. But you really have given a better idea for the sense of this resolution. Coming from there - how does "Bearbeitungsergebnis" or "Beurteilung" sound to you?

Bearbeitungsergebnis sounds nice, even if it has a lot of syllables (Fazit might be a short word which has nearly the same signification). Beurteilung sounds a bit too heavy for my taste, but how's about Bewertung?

(I'm anonymous from comment 48, anonymous from 50 is someone else)

[Robert Rossmair <r.rossmair@…>]

Replying to Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>:

Replying to Simon <saimen54@…>:

• worksforme / ohne Beanstandung -> Maybe "nicht reproduzierbar"?

Normally you do the setup, test it, and say: "for me it works". Then you have reproduced it, but you have judged that you don't object to it. So how do we call that then in German? - "getestet und für gut befunden" - "in Ordnung" - "funktioniert" - ... But in any case you have to make clear whether the implied judgement is about the software or about the ticket.

"nicht reproduzierbar" or, more explicit, "Fehler nicht reproduzierbar" conform to the meaning of worksforme, as defined in  https://developer.mozilla.org/En/What_to_do_and_what_not_to_do_in_Bugzilla or  http://www.suitable.com/docs/mantisbt.html. That can't be said for "ohne Beanstandung".

In another matter, instead of "Individuelle Abfrage" for "custom query" I'd suggest "Benutzerdefinierte Abfrage".

[anonymous]

Replying to sonicpictures:

Replying to Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>:

Replying to anonymous:

Yes, I get your point. As you may have noticed it is not easy to find appropriate terms for everything. The "Status der Lösung" is already the product of some discussion and agreement. But you really have given a better idea for the sense of this resolution. Coming from there - how does "Bearbeitungsergebnis" or "Beurteilung" sound to you?

How about "Ergebnis"? If find this to be the closest translation to "Resolution" and it seems to fit well in the different use cases.

Bearbeitungsergebnis sounds nice, even if it has a lot of syllables (Fazit might be a short word which has nearly the same signification). Beurteilung sounds a bit too heavy for my taste, but how's about Bewertung?

(I'm anonymous from comment 48, anonymous from 50 is someone else)

[jruigrok]

Gregor's patch applied in r8051.

[Qjuh]

Just a little input from an (yet) uninvolved german for the 'resolution'-issue:

What about something like "Prädikat", because I think it somehow has the same complexity as resolution has, but still a compact phrase.

[Robert Rossmair <r.rossmair@…>]

Tickets: I don't like the translation of "Owned by:" as "Verantwortlicher:" (i.e. "person responsible [male]:"). "Verantwortlicher" has a "who to put the blame on if something goes wrong" note, which IMO goes against the spirit of collaboration Trac in my understanding tries to promote. Why not "Gehört:" (which rings positive and would have the benefit of being gender-neutral)? Or, if it absolutely has to be a substantive, "Eigner:"?

[anonymous]

Replying to anonymous:

Replying to sonicpictures:

Replying to Heiko Graeber <ip.3777@…>:

Replying to anonymous:

Yes, I get your point. As you may have noticed it is not easy to find appropriate terms for everything. The "Status der Lösung" is already the product of some discussion and agreement. But you really have given a better idea for the sense of this resolution. Coming from there - how does "Bearbeitungsergebnis" or "Beurteilung" sound to you?

How about "Ergebnis"? If find this to be the closest translation to "Resolution" and it seems to fit well in the different use cases.

I think "Beurteilung" is pretty much what everyone means, in the sense of "Urteil" or "Entscheidung".

Bearbeitungsergebnis sounds nice, even if it has a lot of syllables (Fazit might be a short word which has nearly the same signification). Beurteilung sounds a bit too heavy for my taste, but how's about Bewertung?

"Bewertung" usually a part of a resolution, so to say the reasoning _why_ it was decided so. But it is not the resolution itself.

-Alexander

[anonymous]

Replying to Robert Rossmair <r.rossmair@…>:

Tickets: I don't like the translation of "Owned by:" as "Verantwortlicher:" (i.e. "person responsible [male]:"). "Verantwortlicher" has a "who to put the blame on if something goes wrong" note, which IMO goes against the spirit of collaboration Trac in my understanding tries to promote. Why not "Gehört:" (which rings positive and would have the benefit of being gender-neutral)? Or, if it absolutely has to be a substantive, "Eigner:"?

I think that the correct term would be "Eigentümer".

-Alexander

[cboos]

See also #8933 which proposes some changes to the translations used for the main navigation bar.

[cboos]

Note that I'm currently considering various options for improving the translation workflow: using  Transifex, providing svn accounts for translators, etc. If not already done, people interested should join the Trac-dev MailingList (see  Trac i18n and Transifex).

At this point, the german translation shows 86% completion, not bad, but not perfect either ;-)